Interviewees: Calvin Mitchell, Sandra Lindsey, and Laverne Mitchell
Interviewer: Selah Shorts
April 8th, 2026 @11:35am
Fayetteville St, Mr. Mitchell House
Duration of Interview: 50minutes
00:01 Selah
I'm gonna press record and we are recording. Hi, Mr. Mitchell, Mrs. Sandra, and Mrs. Laverne.
00:12 Mr. Mitchell
How you doing this morning?
00:13 Mrs. Sandra
Hello.
00:14 Selah
I'm good. How are you guys?
00:15 Mr. Mitchell
All right.
00:15 Mrs. Sandra
Very good.
00:16 Selah
Thank you so much for taking the time to speak with me today. My name is Selah Shorts, and I'm working on this project about the Durham Fayetteville Street Historic Corridor, focused on preserving the stories, memories, and history of this community. I'm really here to just listen and learn from you and to better understand what this neighborhood and this home have meant to you and your family over the years. Please feel free to share whatever you're comfortable with. So just to start off with, how was your weekend? What did you do over the weekend?
00:48 Mr. Mitchell
For me to start, weekend w- was, was very kinda successful 'cause I've been, I'm, um, I've been viewing too much news, and the news hadn't been too good for me.
00:58 Selah
Mm-hmm.
00:58 Mr. Mitchell
But other than that, everything's been going real well. And I'm very happy about, um, exposing my dwelling, uh, for historical benefits because I'm, uh, last member of, uh, five persons that reside in this home. So I'm very happy that I'm been able to one, to be the one to be able to not only accommodate what, uh, historical society is doing, but be able to bring Johnny on the spot to give a little bit of conversation about my home and the people that resided in here.
01:33 Selah
And you say how many people have owned this home before you?
01:37 Mr. Mitchell
Of my knowledge, uh, I'm the third of the persons to be involved in it. It was, uh, two others. My great auntie, Ms. Henry Line, and then there's another, uh, owner of the home before her, previous of her. Didn't know that person because at that time, I wouldn't even thought about it. I was very, you know- -relatively, you know, naive child.
01:59 Selah
Okay.
01:59 Mr. Mitchell
That was well before my time.
02:00 Mrs. Sandra
Mm-hmm.
02:00 Mr. Mitchell
So those are the inhabitants I know of.
02:03 Selah
Okay. We're gonna touch there very soon. So where did you go to elementary, middle, and high school?
02:11 Mr. Mitchell
I attended, uh, locally, uh, for elementary in, uh, Pearson High School. Pearson, Pearson High School.
02:18 Mrs. Sandra
Pearson.
02:19 Mr. Mitchell
There we go. That, that's to be exact. Uh, approximately about three or four blocks from my residence here at fourteen o nine Pebble Street. Uh, junior high school, what they call it, 'cause, uh, at that time it was junior high school. Now sometimes they reference it as middle school, but that was done at, uh, Whitted High School. What was that? Is that W-G Whitted?
02:40 Selah
J-A.
02:40 Mr. Mitchell
W-G.
02:40 Selah
It's just Whitted now.
02:43 Mr. Mitchell
Exactly.
02:43 Selah
Mm-hmm.
02:44 Mr. Mitchell
And high school was, uh, about three or four blocks down, which is kind of, kind of... All that I attended was right in a good radius, a short, uh, term radius, was Hillside High School, and that is the older high school, not the newer high school. And that was, was at, is at, was on Concord.
03:02 Mrs. Sandra
It's on Concord. It's actually where your science building is now.
Preservation Durham — Transcription of Oral history Interview
Calvin Mitchell
April 8th 2026
Fayetteville street historic Corridor
03:05 Mr. Mitchell
Beautiful.
03:06 Mrs. Sandra
Yes.
03:06 Mr. Mitchell
Beautiful.
03:07 Mrs. Sandra
Yes.
03:07 Selah
Where our science building is now?
03:09 Mrs. Sandra
Uh-huh.
03:09 Mr. Mitchell
Beautiful.
03:10 Mrs. Sandra
On, on the corner of Lawson.
03:12 Selah
Oh, wow.
03:13 Mrs. Sandra
Right. Yes.
03:14 Selah
So how did the neighborhood come-
00:00 Mr. Mitchell
Say other Black neighborhoods with, uh, one-family homes and, uh, residents were very close and accordance, and, uh, it was a vary of, what do you wanna call 'em? You had scholars, so there was a mix of people. You know, you had some, uh, engineers, uh, and you had some scholars. You had different diversity over there at that time. But it was real nice. It was wholesome. It was a good living.
00:26 Selah
Hmm.
00:26 Speaker 3
Very nice.
00:29 Mr. Mitchell
Yes.
00:32 Selah
What has your career journey looked like during your time here in Fayetteville?
00:39 Mr. Mitchell
It has been-
00:41 Selah
Enduring.
00:42 Mr. Mitchell
Enduring. It's been beautiful. I wanted to kinda escalate my... E-escalate in some form, but at that time, in s- in schools or colleges then, 'cause really universities, uh, the tab was a university, but it really looked like a college. It was a little smaller. They didn't have diversities of field of study when I came up. So you didn't have a large kinda association of, of choices. So you, and you kind of would go with how that college was set up, really. And it wasn't too deemed of having a lot of variety. I went to a, a formal HBCU, which is North Carolina Central University now. But at that time it was, it still was a good... I think I still had a good, uh, approach to education, but I don't have, I didn't have the choices what they have now. I wish for the choices, but you have to be predicated on the time.
01:38 Selah
Mm-hmm.
01:39 Mr. Mitchell
And so, so that way.
01:41 Selah
What was your major?
01:43 Mr. Mitchell
I was in business administration.
01:45 Selah
Mm-hmm.
01:45 Mr. Mitchell
So, not on, uh, I would say PE 'cause I really wanted to be a coach. To say what coach, I would kind of specify basketball. I was really a basketball enthusiast. But I just gravitated to business and, uh, it was good. But as I said, I didn't have enough flexibility and choices of field of study, what they have now in these times now. If I had that, it would've been glorious, and I could've had more choices and could've, you know, more things I could've probably accomplished.
02:17 Selah
Mm-hmm. Since nineteen thirty-five, this home has been standing on Fayetteville Street as part of your family story for a century. What makes memories stand out most for you about growing up here?
02:37 Mr. Mitchell
I would like to have my cousin, who she's blank left to me, as a, a little helpmate on really giving some really top-notch. I'm gonna start, start with it. Uh, the knowledge what I have is, uh, basically when I was a teenager more so than I was a child, is sketchy kind of memory of chi- of my childhood here. I have some good things in, in childhood that I, I like to be based on more of a pro than a con. But, uh, my teenage, my teenage years, it was glorious. I had, I was fortunate to be in this home with older persons that I gained a lot of knowledge for. And I was a stickler for understanding and finding out because some kids I saw, oh, I was, I had a high percentage to be there with the old ones while, while they were living, and they told me about the present, the past. Not so much of futuristic because of their years, they didn't really think too far ahead. They didn't because they didn't have a lot of education, or they could view things in the future. But they really talked about the past and the present, and they really informed me in order to carry on generational knowledge. That's what I want to say. Because I'm able to take what they gave me and add to my generation and then add to my kids' generation.
04:03 Selah
Mm-hmm.
04:03 Mr. Mitchell
So it was good.
04:05 Selah
So what is one piece of knowledge that you think they gave you that you would give me?
04:11 Mr. Mitchell
Off the, uh, basically on the top is family orientation. My great auntie who was the owner of this home when I came along as a teenager and all, she was a very stickler for basic family values. She was, uh, she was not able to really do writing, so she would, uh, outstandingly... All she did was, uh, was a foundation of put or maybe a letter to outstanding of her name in order anything kinda occur-occurrence of something had to be documented. That's how she was able to do it. But even with her limited amounts of education, she was well beyond her years, and I learned so much from her. She was very calm. She was so unique at her age that sh- you were a- she was able to let you know within a way in the same kind with, with you in, in that type of time about how to deal onl- and how to understand things as you progress in your life. And it was outstanding to me 'cause I could-- I've never been around anybody like that.
05:21 Selah
Mm-hmm.
05:22 Mr. Mitchell
Out of all the older people that I've been around in family and outside of family and friends, how she gave me understanding was second to none at her age, and she was... Give me an age, Sandra, that you know of her in her passing 'cause I'm thinking, I was thinking in the hundreds. You're saying in the-
05:39 Mrs. Sandra
It was in the nineties.
05:40 Mr. Mitchell
In the nineties.
05:40 Mrs. Sandra
She was in the upper nineties when she passed.
05:42 Mr. Mitchell
When she passed. Owner of this home.
05:44 Mrs. Sandra
Yeah. But to piggyback on what he said, um, what Calvin just said, um, this was first, actually, this was a unique neighborhood, a unique area. It was the prime location for African Americans during that time.
06:00 Selah
Mm-hmm.
06:01 Mrs. Sandra
Uh, it was called the Hayti District. Uh, you had, um-Entrepreneurs, you had doctors, you had, um, uh, business owners, uh, you had, um, uh, school teachers and education, and it showed in the value of their homes and how they, they take-- took care of those homes. They were very well-maintained. This was the prime location in regards to Afri-African Americans in Durham. Um, getting back to the oldest member of the family who owned the home, uh, this was our settings for all of our family gatherings. And not only that, it was also settings for community activities in regards to, uh, the church that both of, uh, Calvin's grandmother as well as, um, his, um, great aunt that was here. Uh, they had tea parties here. They had all kinds of social events. They celebrated special occasions here. So it was actually, um, the center of the majority of our family occasions. Um, the area was, um, set apart from any other area as far as African Americans, uh, in Durham. And, um, everyone who lived in the area showed that pride by the maintain-- how they maintained their dwellings. Um, it was the center location for all of our affairs and activities here. And it was... Everyone that lived in the area was very, very proud of, of where they were.
07:57 Selah
That has changed now. How do you think... Not even how, it's like you can just see it. Why?
08:08 Mrs. Sandra
Why did it change?
08:09 Selah
Yeah.
08:12 Mrs. Sandra
I think a lot of it was because, um, well, generations.
08:19 Mr. Mitchell
I like that.
08:19 Mrs. Sandra
Okay. Uh, and I, I think this would probably be the same with other generations that have, you know, developed in a sense.
08:31 Selah
Mm-hmm.
08:32 Mrs. Sandra
Um, the la- the latter generations don't take the same kind of pride that the original generation had when they were, um, developing the area. Um, it may not have been as hard for the latter generation, but it was very hard for the first generation to acquire and accumulate what they have. So I think that's probably one reason. Um, uh, and the other reason I think is because, um, the area was fragmented. And I think the area was given a lot of promises. They were promised certain things that certainly did not take place. Uh, and I think that's where a lot of the pride as well as the, the desire to keep the area in the same shape that it was, um, in the beginning. Uh, urban renewal destroyed us. It destroyed us.
09:47 Mr. Mitchell
Mm-hmm.
09:49 Mrs. Sandra
There were other areas, um, that could have been, uh, used as far as, uh, what's that one forty-seven, the expressway.
09:59 Mr. Mitchell
Expressway.
09:59 Selah
Mm-hmm.
10:01 Mrs. Sandra
But it came directly-
10:03 Selah
That toll
10:04 Mrs. Sandra
... in the heart of what our people worked hard for.
10:10 Mr. Mitchell
Mm-hmm.
10:11 Mrs. Sandra
I get very passionate about it because I left Durham just as they were beginning to develop the urban renewal. And then when I came back after so many years, to see the destruction that now still exists is very, very hard for me-
10:36 Mr. Mitchell
Mm-hmm
10:36
... to see.
10:38 Mr. Mitchell
The progression of industry, all that kinda going on, because the industry at that time was maintaining, which is tobacco and those kinda industries. That level, that probably helped a lot with not only what she said, but it helped a lot with generations were looking for more monies and more things, more advantages that at that time, Durham was not moving in that, that kinda direction. Once one industry, that they didn't have a backup plan to industry to keep it more as strong as it was. It took some time and space before industry renewed itself in another direction that the reemergence of Durham started to come back in a different way. Whether it's gonna be that way anyway, 'cause years change. Old things change to new things, but it took a little more time with Durham to change. It wasn't just indirectly that they weren't prepared, and it took a lot, a little longer, other than what she said. But I think the main part of it was what she spoke upon.
11:33 Mrs. Sandra
False promises.
11:34 Mr. Mitchell
Exactly. Exactly. That's what's happening.
11:38 Selah
And Durham is still changing.
11:39 Mrs. Sandra
Yes.
11:40 Mr. Mitchell
Yes.
11:40 Mrs. Sandra
It's changing.
11:41 Selah
Mm-hmm.
11:43 Mr. Mitchell
Going through it.
11:44 Selah
I wanted to get back to your Aunt. She also survived enslavement. Aunt Allie Mitchell. She raised her family in this home and helped keep it in this family for generations. What do you hope people understand about her role in that journey?
12:03 Mr. Mitchell
One thing I wanna redoc-- have a redocumentation of that, Allie Mitchell was my grandmother Henrietta Lyon is, was my great auntie, which was, uh, beholden as the owner of the home. But my grandmother resided with my auntie here. Uh, this home was, or you want inherit- Not inherited, it was given to my great auntie from, uh, a very prestigious woman in, and family in, uh, Durham, North Carolina. Uh, my-- At that time, my auntie and my grandmother were what you wanna call, were, were service workers.
12:46 Selah
Mm.
12:47 Mr. Mitchell
And that inclined to be a description of it that they took care of families, prominent families. And the family that she took care of was, her name was Miss Minnie Yerby. But they were Yerby family. But she was the direct, what you wanna call direct person that dealt with my great auntie, that I know or spoke about.
13:09 Selah
Mm.
13:09 Mr. Mitchell
It could've been her husband too, but she dealt with more in-inclination of who, uh, Miss Minnie Yerby was her direct correlation or contact. And this home was one of the homes that were offered to my auntie. It was two homes that were offered, this home and another home that was probably no more than about just... Not in front of this home, but it was a home that was just adjacent to the left of this home, across the street, which was a two-story home. And, uh, that was the choice of my auntie. And she didn't take any time in, if, if from what I heard, in making her choice. She enjoyed this home and where the setting was, and that's what she chose to be her home. But it, and it was so indifferent then, and so out of the norm, I would say, that that would be a presentation to a Black family. And ownership, not in like leasehold agreements, not like in rental agreements, but ownership. And my auntie was one to be, have advantage of that. And I thought it was prestigious myself at that time, 'cause gifts of that combination were, you know, were really not something that was on a regular basis. You know what I'm saying? So...
14:31 Selah
To be able to own something, m-it means a lot. And we've had, we've had quite a talk over the past few weeks about what's going on with your house. You... Remember you had told me you had got a letter? Could you tell me more about that? Remember that letter?
14:50 Mr. Mitchell
Well, what was going on that I had not, not... They really didn't want a finished product with it, was annexation-
14:57 Selah
Mm-hmm
14:58 Mr. Mitchell
... that is really going down everywhere in Durham. Not only in Durham, but let me just be precise saying Durham. And I was kind of taking a little bit off on my knowledge, but it ha- It's a continuum with that. And basically, the meetings that were going on to establish it had been... I don't, I'm, I'm trying to use the right word in saying derailed or whatever, or being reappropriated to another time, and I think it will come back up. I really, I know it will come back up. And that really had me uncertain. But due to the fact of the historical s- uh, society, the last kinda conversation that I and my wife, Laverne, had, they really pinpointed what was going on with that. And the conversation was so good, and the ladies were so good, my- I didn't really need to have any, uh, any more understanding of it 'cause they were so precise. I, I really wanna take my hat off to them. They are very gorgeous ladies, and they work, they are really working r-with me so much and to help this home to be established historically. And I have nothing to say. I'm just, I'm just proud that the fact that, that they have, are able to accompany me as that. 'Cause it really me as the last, uh, occupant of this home through the five that originally were here, that I'm able to see it through. And I'm really, I'm happy that I can give some background, and adjacent to my, my cousin, who has a lot of historical facts that she understands about that can help add to the situation. It's gorgeous. I'm living, I'm living on, like on cloud nine. I'm living on cloud nine.
16:30 Selah
So could you tell me more about those facts?
16:33 Mrs. Sandra
About the ownership of the home and all, or?
16:36 Selah
Mm-hmm.
16:37 Mrs. Sandra
Yes. Well, from my understanding, yes, the house, uh, as Calvin had, uh, explained, owned by, uh, a prominent family here in, um, Durham. And as a young individual, I think his great aunt, whose name was Henrietta Lyon, uh, was a service individual or took care of this, uh, um, particular lady. And, um, in her passing, she had, um, precip-specifically stated that the home was to be turned over to Henrietta Lyon. Um, that's my understanding and, you know, that's what I know in regards to the ownership of the home and all.
17:26 Selah
So what are your plans for the future with this home?
17:30 Mrs. Sandra
Well, it would have to be Calvin's plans-
17:32 Selah
Mm-hmm
17:32 Mr. Mitchell
... for the future of the home. Uh, let me just say this. Let me just specifically say this also. I am so proud of him in regards to how he has stewarded this house. Um, as stated earlier, there are so many fond memories of family affairs here, and just walking into the house brings back so many great memories of the family gatherings that we had here. Um, and for him to, uh, put in the energy andThe pride that is shown by him maintaining this house just warms my heart in so many ways.
18:20 Mr. Mitchell
Thank you.
18:20 Mrs. Sandra
And, uh-
18:22 Mr. Mitchell
Thank you, . That's beautiful.
18:24 Mrs. Sandra
Yes.
18:27 Mr. Mitchell
Beautiful.
18:28 Selah
What are one of the memories?
18:30 Mrs. Sandra
One of the memories? Um, in addition to his grandmother and his great aunt, which would be, which would be my great aunt as well, uh, the three sisters-- Well, actually there were five of them that remained, uh, during my childhood. They would get together and during family meals, I mean, they would, you know, the traditional dinners and, uh, sitting around speaking about various things, yeah, you know, historical things as far as the family was concerned. Um, it was just, um, something that, um, you know, just, you know, helped me in regards to, um, seeing the value of what, uh, African American families stood on and how well it kept us together in a sense. Uh, and I-- That in itself are the fond memories of the family with all of the older individuals taking care and reminding us and, uh, encouraging us to, to, uh, to go further. And when, you know, we look back on it, when I look back on it as such, um... And these were people who literally started with little or nothing to get where they are, to also-- to encourage us to go further with what we have, which is, is, is, is just, is just wonderful in the sense that, you know, we were offered that opportunity. I mean, I, I, I value that in so many ways.
20:15 Selah
Yeah, I do too, to be honest.
20:17 Mr. Mitchell
Mm-hmm.
20:18 Selah
Just, like, looking around, I'm like, "Yeah, I, I gotta, I gotta do it."
20:22 Mrs. Sandra
Mm-hmm.
20:22 Selah
I gotta do something. Could you tell me about one of your fondest memories?
20:28 Mrs. Sandra
The fondest memories, like I said, w-was the family.
20:31 Selah
I was... I w-
20:31 Mr. Mitchell
Talking about me.
20:32 Mrs. Sandra
Oh, I'm sorry.
20:33 Mr. Mitchell
It's all good.
20:34 Selah
But you can tell me another one if you want.
20:36 Mr. Mitchell
No, I'm just playing. I, I love when, I love when you do that.
20:38 Selah
Yes. Yes.
20:39 Mr. Mitchell
I'll take the stage for that one. I'll take the stage for that one. But I'm gonna go back and just add to what she's saying, 'cause fam-family values are one of the most established things here. Uh, me from youth, teenager, young adult, to now being a senior, uh, different variants of that. But when all five were together, meaning all five, meaning me as the added, the four, meaning the five, it was a lot of things that really capped off life for me. Meaning I had the vessel, the older world, the end time of my father and mother at that, uh, uh, timeframe, which my, was my major time for me would be, like, in the seventies 'cause I was teenage years. And I had a really good amass understanding of what was going on because that was following me over to my adult years, where I really had to-- would be capped on what I was gonna do in my life. So it was just a base here. As I said, I wish my cousin could've, you know... You know, I say that to them all the time, all my cousins. To my other, my cousin I love, Sandra, I see that on a regular basis. I wish they would've had the opportunity I had around them, but they didn't. I, I had a twenty-four hour. They had inserts of, like, twelve hours, a little bit, maybe one day of the weekend opposed to the day and then a full week. I had it all. And it was so good for me because I could just... That's why I'm so glad I'm here to establish what the past was because I knew it so vividly. It was so vivid. So to, you, to make, again, the recount, that was, that was one of the most major things was family. The other part of it, I had a gift that not a lot of kids had, meaning you had to be of a family name or family somewhat like lawyers or doctors, those kind of things, and it means a financial stability. I didn't have a family of note-wise, name-wise value, but everyone in the household worked. And I was, I had to be, I was the only you-- only child, so I got everything I just about wanted. And even my father would relate to my mother, "You're gonna spoil him," because it came to me. I had no-- I had to worry about sharing anything. But they did make the understanding of me about work ethic and responsibility, because had they not, I would've thought I just supposed to have. So that, but the, the main statement, that's why I go back to clarity of family, because it taught me the right values, and I never progressed too fast. I had the normal, and I'm gonna conclude on it, I had the normal of kids going up and down, but it was pros and cons with every kid that lives. But mine was even more efficient because everybody was upholding my growth.
23:39 Selah
How many kids do you have?
23:41 Mr. Mitchell
I have two gentlemen. You say two kids, I say gentlemen, 'cause now they are, they are adult age.
23:47 Selah
Mm-hmm.
23:47 Selah
Mm-hmm.
23:48 Mr. Mitchell
And three grandkids, and I have one great-grand. So life is, man, it's beautiful that I'm able to see generations like that. I hope to the fact that I have enough life in my body that I'll be able to conversate with my great-grand, and she knows me for me, not be told about who am, my person and who I am through the, through the eyes of my sons and my granddaughter.Then she'll know something about me. And I always use-- so I validate to all my grandkids about certain things and tell them certain things so they can go on. And even though it, um, if I pass or when I pass, re-rephrase 'cause I will, uh, I will say certain core, core things to them. My grandson, I asked him about his truth, and he'll tell me he knows now because I quantify this every time we're around when we, when we are probably... He lives in another township, but I quantify that about his truth. And he knows when I talk about him, his truth, meaning where he is right now to where he wants to go. So that'll ring in his ears when I'm not there. One thing he'll say about, about my grandfather, about all things I want him to understand, he, when he looks at a picture of me and if I'm gone, my grandfather always spoke about my truth, and that lends an ear to him to go forward. Other what his parents say, is go-- I've put something like that and instill in him a value. So, so those kind of things I try to do.
25:20 Selah
Do they stay around here?
25:23 Mr. Mitchell
No, they don't. My youngest son, uh, he resides in, um, it's a suburb of, uh, Charlotte. It's called Stanley, North Carolina. And my oldest son, he resides in Greensboro, North Carolina. But they are very in a good radius that they can come vi- and visit me or I can visit them, and it's beautiful. 'Cause to be honest with you, when you talk to me what kind of concepts I had in mind for this household, immediacy of it is not the same as I have to have a lot of conversation with my wife because that is really the conclusion of it. But I do have things in mind that I would like to reside next to one of my kids being the same where they can... I can reap the value of being around my grandkids and them, and they don't have to travel so far. So that's my long-term goal. Will I reach it? I have a plan. But it'll have to be in a change. But the basis of that comes with a whole lot of conversation with my wife.
26:23 Selah
Okay.
26:24 Mr. Mitchell
And my cousin, too.
26:25 Selah
Mm-hmm. Okay. Switching turns here, what is it like having a university as part of your everyday environment? Like, how is it during like homecoming for you? Like, do you guys get mad that we're parking-
26:43 Mrs. Sandra
I love it.
26:44 Selah
Okay.
26:46 Mrs. Sandra
I mean, just to see people coming together like that, I love it. And, uh, uh, you know, one of the things about the, you know, being close to an HBCU is that you get all of that, that, that flavor in a sense of, um-
27:03 Selah
Good word, flavor
27:04 Mrs. Sandra
... you know, homecoming. I tell everyone, if you have never had an experience of, uh, witnessing a HBCU homecoming, you're missing out on a whole lot. A whole lot. Now, this house here, because they used to have parades, the parade would start, you know, miles from here downtown. It would come through the Pettigrew, I mean, the, yeah, the Pettigrew Street corridor, and then it would come down Fayetteville Street. I mean, it would be lined with people from all over, uh, with the various, uh, bands from different, uh, high schools throughout North Carolina, and it was just a gathering, a great gathering-
27:47 Mr. Mitchell
Yeah
27:47 Mrs. Sandra
... for, uh, uh, for Black people during that time. It was just wonderful. It was just wonderful.
27:57 Mr. Mitchell
Yes. I am, uh, not a grad. I did two years of, uh, at s- North Carolina Central University, which right is still not too far, three blocks from here. And the same, what she was speaking upon is the same value system because it was... I look at homecoming at HBCU, uh, to be specific, it's like a home. It's, it's more like not even a homecoming for the university. It's a homecoming for the whole community and extended because if I'm thinking right, the ones I've been through, and I've been to a lot of HBCUs-
28:33 Selah
Which ones?
28:35 Mr. Mitchell
Uh, well, I would say close in dynamics of let, let's just say within, uh, Raleigh-
28:40 Selah
Mm. Uh-huh. Yeah
28:41 Mr. Mitchell
... Durham-Chapel Hill area to a more extension because we have HBCUs in. That North, uh, Durham to me is a college town anyway because of the exclusionary of Duke, Duke University and North Carolina Central, but and Durham Tech too at that time, but which it was kind of evolving into a college. That's what Durham Tech seemed to evolving in. But what I was trying to say is, uh, Central at the time was a basic of like a homecoming value, and most of them are located in communities. Most HBCUs are right within, you know, the downtown areas of the, of the place, the basic of the Black community. Most of them. I don't know how all changed. Alcorn I have not been to. You know, I can speak on some stuff, but the ones I've been to, you know, it's lodged right in the Black community. So it gives a homecoming flavor. So you just get... You're a part of the, the university because it's so close. And I loved that, and I loved I grew into it. I would love for it to stay like that because I think with the gravitating in a way that a lot of HBCUs don't, they're not as legendary, and they are losing their s- their, their closeness and understanding the values of the Black community. I hope that would stay like that. Even though you can, you can integrate, you can change concepts or in different, uh, uh, ethnic groups coming in, but the basis of it is a Black community, college, university. That's establishment.
30:14 Selah
How do we keep that?
30:17 Mr. Mitchell
Oh, that's very hard 'cause I w- I, I was... And let-- She's gonna... I'm gonna let my cousin, uh, this-
30:25 Mrs. Sandra
The question was how do you keep the, the closeness-
30:29 Selah
Of the community
30:30 Mrs. Sandra
... of the community around the HBCU?
30:32 Selah
Mm-hmm.
30:34 Mrs. Sandra
Um, I think, well, I think it, it, it, it, it, it requires, you know, the community as well as the school-
30:42 Mr. Mitchell
Yes
30:43 Mrs. Sandra
... knowing each other and, and staying closely, closely connected with each other.
30:49 Mr. Mitchell
Beautiful.
30:49 Mrs. Sandra
Um, uh, the s- the community, you know, making certain that the school is aware of their concerns and needs as, and the school vice versa, letting the c-community know of their, their needs as well. Um, just staying closely knit together.
31:12 Mr. Mitchell
I mean, they can even volley to the fact of adding like a special committee to that, a hospitality committee to where, um, they can do more pro... Somewhat like what you're doing now, where you can really understand and know the families of in that area, in their community, and, and bridge the gap with a lot of questions, a lot of q- uh, question and answers. And I think that will help generationally because as one ge-generation fades or passes, there's another generation that coming in, and they have their different views. And so by having committees like that can keep up with that value system because it's kinda hard to just basic on, "I'm an older guy, and my needs are few." And, um, my generation, uh, m- the next generation, my sons have their different viewpoint, and you have to make s- uh, cl- uh, clarity of both viewpoints, my i- mine and my next, you know, next, you know, generation. I-- That's my thought of it. And I would take... I would think that, that you can... we can even put in a broad side of, uh, Durham as a whole, meaning memorial, meaning c- uh, you know, all of that. We, we need to do all of that. And it could be a processes set. But how, how that would be done, I don't know. But I think that's a good start, very good start.
32:37 Selah
Are there any restaurants or food spots around Fayetteville Street or nearby that you remember going to often? Which ones have lasted or which ones do you miss the most?
32:47 Mr. Mitchell
You wanna start?
32:50 Mrs.Sandra
Well, there are some, you know. I, I think there are some more so down, um, further down Fayetteville Street. Um, but prior to urban renewal, there were a lot of, a lot of restaurants that were in the area on Pettigrew Street. Um-
33:10 Selah
Can you name them?
33:12 Mrs. Sandra
Yeah. Elmira's Restaurant, Elmira, um-
33:16 Mr. Mitchell
College Inn.
33:17 Mrs. Sandra
The College Inn.
33:18 Mr. Mitchell
Mm-hmm.
33:19 Mrs. Sandra
Uh, next to the WD Hill Recreation Center here was the College Inn, and you could go in and out of there, and you could get, you know, some quick meal. Um-
33:30 Mr. Mitchell
Very prominent.
33:31 Mrs. Sandra
Yeah. Very, very prominent.
33:33 Selah
I think I've seen the El... You said the Elmer's? Elmira's?
33:37 Mrs. Sandra
Elmira's Restaurant.
33:40 Selah
El-
33:40 Mrs. Sandra
Uh, that was on Pettigrew Street.
33:42 Selah
On Pettigrew Street?
33:43 Mrs. Sandra
Yeah.That was on Pettigrew at the corner almost.
33:46 Selah
Mm-hmm.
33:46
It was a restaurant called Elmira's.
33:48 Selah
Mm-hmm.
33:49 Mrs. Sandra
And I understand that there are several of them, like I said, on the further end, um, uh, of, of Fayetteville Street down towards, uh, what is that? Cornwallis Road.
34:01 Mr. Mitchell
That's exactly right.
34:03 Mrs Sandra
Yeah. Some of them. Yeah.
34:05 Mr. Mitchell
National chains were not the quote, unquote "thing" then. It was more like a moms and pop type setting-
34:12 Selah
Mm-hmm
34:12 Mr. Mitchell
... where they had more or less, I would say, uh, more predicated on a basic meal opposed to exotic meal or something that was like... I don't know how you wanna s- uh, call, call it. The menu was so basic. It was just like the same kind of meals or the same kind of eats that you received at your household. It was so easy to go to those places because it wasn't... You were not going so much to something that you didn't really know a taste of. The only taste of it is how they prepared it, but they were so... It was so close-
34:46 Selah
Mm-hmm
34:46 Mr. Mitchell
... and all prepared that certain, uh... If chicken was on the menu, it was a variation of different way you could cook it, but chicken is chicken. And you know, you go on your spare rib, your... and then your vegetables, but they were vegetables that mom and pop cooked. It was just extension, might be one night when we don't wanna cook, or this is a special occasion, we're gonna go here. But tho- And they were so well about it. It was so good. I would... And they kinda seem like they're gravitating back to that 'cause I see a lot of what you wanna call mom and pops places are coming up-
35:19 Selah
Mm-hmm
35:19 Mr. Mitchell
... replacing these national chains, and they're much better on food grouping, they're better on, on health, and all of that 'cause they're much better done, you know.
35:31 Mrs Sandra
Well, in addition to restaurants, there were a whole amount, a whole lot of other things too.
35:35 Mr. Mitchell
Yeah.
35:36 Mrs Sandra
You know, there was a groc- There were nice stores, you know, food stores. Um, you had, um, movie theater. You had, um, pharmacists. You had... Now, in addition to that, you had, um, a hotel. You had doctor's offices. You had businesses. There was absolutely no need to go outside of the community-
36:02 Mr. Mitchell
That's exactly right
36:02 Mrs Sandra
... to, uh, have your need met.
36:05 Mr. Mitchell
Yes, exactly.
36:05 Mrs Sandra
It was all here.
36:07 Selah
Right here.
36:08 Mr. Mitchell
Yeah.
36:08 Mrs Sandra
It was all right here.
36:11 Mr. Mitchell
That's right.
36:12 Selah
Did you ever go to the Carolina Theater?
36:14 Mrs. Sandra
Yes. The Carolina Theater, and I just learned recently that the Carolina Theater had almost 100 stairs that we had to walk upTo get to where we were allowed to view movies and all. The Carolina Theater was a popular spot, and you know, they had another one theater also down there called the Center Theater. But the Carolina Theater was unique in that, uh, African Americans had to climb so many stairs to get up into the second balcony, uh, to watch a movie. And, um, yeah.
36:53 Selah
I actually went over there not too long ago and walked up those stairs. I didn't know y'all had to do all that just to watch a movie.
37:00 Mrs. Sandra
Watch a movie.
37:01 Selah
Yeah. That's a lot of stairs.
37:06 Mrs. Sandra
Yes. Yes.
37:06 Mr. Mitchell
Yes. Things were very different then. Very different.
37:10 Selah
Yeah. That's actually so crazy to think a- to think about.
37:13 Mr. Mitchell
Protocol with history is like day and night differences. Think about it, we can recall it. You know what I mean? It's, it's, it's still memory banks. It's almost like you can just close your eyes and just comes alive. But it was pro in the color. But before me, like I said, my great auntie and those before us, I just imagine what they went through. I could not even cap it, but they did. And they preserved the fact for our family to be on... have a base that you could really gain from. And I just hope with this and what, what, what I'm doing right here now and with my cousin, will be a laid platform for them to understand with our generations. They can understand, and it's coming out our mouths, that this is what it's all, and they can take the advantages of what I have, what my, uh, cousin so prominently said, this home is not only my home. My great auntie always spoke to me in words of saying, "This is just a home, and it's predicated for our family. But your home is right in your heart, and you carry it away." And our family extended pro- probably in town and extended family, they look at this home like a, a plug-in, like a, a recharge because they remember all the wholesomeness in there, where they got started. It just, it, it recounts stability in generations. That's why I work so hard to keep it up, not for my benefit, but it's beautiful that I'm gonna have accountability of it, but for my cousins and all my family. That's the reason why I do what I do.
38:52 Selah
Mm-hmm. You said they worked in homes, your great aunt and grandmother. Were those white or Black homes?
39:08 Mrs Sandra
Definitely white homes.
39:10 Selah
Mm-hmm.
39:11 Mrs. Sandra
Definitely white homes.
39:12 Selah
Could you tell me a bit more about that?
39:15 Mrs. Sandra
Um, it was, you know, during that time, you know, you had people who provided the service to, uh, white people for their, you know, housekeeping, uh, for cooking, uh, for their laundry, for taking care of their children, and these were servitude jobs that, um, a lot of Black people, uh, worked at, and they felt proud of the, those positions in a sense. Um, no matter how it may appear now that, you know, you were a servant, but it was, um, it was an honor in a sense to, um, to be able to work as well as to be able to provide for your family.
40:11 Mr. Mitchell
True.
40:11 Mrs. Sandra
And, um, there were, you know, certain situations where things did, you know, work out well for Black people in that sense.
40:19 Mr. Mitchell
Yes.
40:20 Mrs. Sandra
Um, they took care of children who grew up to be adults, who also valued, you know, or had a, a loving relationship with the people that took care of them.
40:37 Selah
And as they should.
40:39 Mr. Mitchell
Yes.
40:40 Selah
Yeah. I honestly, I couldn't really imagine like going to work in somebody's home, like taking care of their kids, taking care of them, and just... I don't know. I couldn't imagine that nowadays. Like-
40:52 Mrs. Sandra
Oh, no. Not nowadays.
40:53 Selah
Yeah, no.
40:54 Mrs. Sandra
No. Not nowadays.
40:57 Selah
Mm-mm.
40:57 Mrs. Sandra
No. No. Not nowadays.
40:58 Selah
Mm-mm.
41:00 Mrs. Sandra
And it was generational.
41:02 Mr. Mitchell
It was.
41:02 Selah
Right.
41:03 Mrs. Sandra
It was generational. You know, you may have taken care of a child who, who grew up to have their own children and-
41:10 Selah
And then you take care of them
41:11 Mrs. Sandra
...these people, and to take care of them as well.
41:13 Selah
Yeah.
41:14 Mr. Mitchell
Mm-hmm.
41:14 Selah
Like to think now that's wild, but to think back then that that wasn't wild.
41:19 Mr. Mitchell
True.
41:19 Mrs. Sandra
Mm-hmm.
41:22 Mr. Mitchell
True.
41:22 Selah
Yeah. Oh. Like that's just crazy. Like I don't know. Like I just try to be so grateful for like what I have right now, what I have.
41:36 Mrs. Sandra
Well, it was because of sacrifice.
41:38 Selah
Mm-hmm.
41:38 Mrs. Sandra
You know, I, I, I often recall, um, you know, my parents in regards to, you know, how they, uh, would encourage me in regards to me moving forward with whenever I got to the point of graduating from high school and all. You know, it was an encouragement. It was, um, you know, they wanted more, especially for, um, than they had-- than what they had. So they gave you a vision in regard to, you know, you can do this, you can be this, and they were very, very supportive, um, as, um, trying to get you started in that right direction.
42:25 Selah
Mm-hmm.
42:26 Mrs. Sandra
I, I value just all that my parents did in regards to encouraging me to, to move forward when I left home.
42:35 Selah
Mm-hmm.
42:35 Mrs. Sandra
You know?
42:38 Selah
I'm, I, I'm also feeling gratitude towards like, you know, the older generation-
42:45 Mr. Mitchell
Mm-hmm
42:45 Selah
... and the ones who come towards me because just to think that your parents only had such a limited education, and my grandmother only had a limited education, and now here I am getting my education.
43:00 Mrs. Sandra
Right.
43:02 Selah
It just puts a lot of things into perspective for me.
43:04 Speaker 3
Right. And when you look at it, you know, a lot of us are first-generational college graduates.
43:10 Mr. Mitchell
That's right.
43:11 Mrs. Sandra
And, um, you know, I often think of, of how proud my parents were, you know, with, uh, seeing me graduate.
43:23 Mr. Mitchell
Mm-hmm.
43:23 Mrs. Sandra
And, um, it was just... It was the vision that they had for me.
43:30 Mr. Mitchell
I was the first in my family-
43:32 Selah
First?
43:32 Mr. Mitchell
To get, yeah, a diploma and, uh, to have, uh, proceeded into college. I was the first in the family to do it. E-e-everything was just like , it was a new day, new time, and everything was so, you know... I looked at it, I hate to say it, po-blase because I was around it. I was nor- it was normal to me. For them, they didn't have that, so the celebration was on.
43:55 Selah
Mm-hmm.
43:55 Mr. Mitchell
I mean, they just... I said, "Okay, but wait a minute. I don't need all that. I don't need all..." But I did it, and I'm glad I still parlayed on in it 'cause I'm kind of a private person. But I did it because they were elated, and then I-- after they spoke to me, uh, as my cousin, about how tough it was and how getting an education was very hard. And I was like, "You excelled. You gotta be happy that you excelled." And it was too, it was so normal to me be-because around me, ev-everybody else was excelling. But they didn't have that opportunity, and it really sold it to me. And I, and I... Now it was, it's something that I remember about them, that I understand how much it meant because I started really start listening and how they told me about they didn't have the education. They weren't afforded the education, and they just had to do what they did. And, um, it's just beautiful that we, that I in this house had that. But I had, just like I said, in this house, it was so much based on family incentives that almost I could not lose.
45:05 Selah
Mm-hmm.
45:06 Mr. Mitchell
The love was there. The guidance was there. Everything was prepped for me to have success. The only thing I had to do was one thing that was totally easy. Just be successful. It was easy to keep the home going because my auntie kept everything going. I think that's the easiest thing in the world when you inherit a home, that you don't have to pay mortgage, you don't have to do anything. The best, the, the, the, the only thing really to be present about in it is just to keep the overall going and change in the dynamics of generations and how things have changed from what they were to what they are, and that's why I said so prominently Historical Society. They give the me the means of understanding how I can do it under a certain k- um, under a certain kind of charter. 'Cause that's one thing I didn't know. The unknown factor was, what could I do in preserving my home? And they gave me indicators that I really feel comfortable about. I really didn't... I didn't have no real understanding of that.
46:13 Mrs. Sandra
Okay. I'm gonna have to leave.
46:15 Selah
That's, that's okay. We can actually cut it. We could f- we could finish if like-
46:21 Mr. Mitchell
Okay.
46:21 Selah
That's cool.
46:22 Mrs. Sandra
Yeah.
46:23 Selah
Okay. I really appreciate-
46:26 Mr. Mitchell
I'm ready to end now. I don't know what else to say.
46:28 Selah
You, I really appreciate-
46:31 Mrs. Sandra
Thank you
46:31 Selah
... the time being here.
46:32 Mrs. Sandra
It was such a pleasure.
46:32 Selah
Yes.
46:33 Mrs. Sandra
Thank you very much. It was a pleasure.
46:35 Mr. Mitchell
It really was.
46:36 Mrs. Sandra
It really was a pleasure.
46:37 Selah
Do you have j-just anything else you'd like to say, or are we good?
46:41 Mrs. Sandra
Um, what I'd y- what I'd like to say is, I'd like to thank you-
46:47 Selah
Thank you
46:48 Spea
... for actually, um, giving us the opportunity to share this.
46:53 Selah
Thank you for giving me the opportunity to share this.
46:56 Mr. Mitchell
At one place.
46:57 Selah
I couldn't do this without, I couldn't do this without the generation above me.
47:00 Speaker 3
Right.
47:01 Selah
So.
47:02 Mr. Mitchell
Yeah. I have one thing to say.
47:03 Selah
Mm-hmm.
47:03 Mr. Mitchell
I wanna add it up for my wife to come in to be, uh, caught in the picture because she's a part of my foundation-
47:09 Selah
Please
47:09 Mr. Mitchell
... in this home.
47:10 Selah
Please.
47:10 Mr. Mitchell
And I would love her to be seen in here-
47:12 Mrs. Sandra
Sit right here
47:13 Mr. Mitchell
... because she helps me keep this-
47:15 Mrs. Sandra
Yeah, she's a beautiful lady.
47:18 Mr. Mitchell
Yeah.
47:18 Selah
Yes. Uh, yes.
47:19 Mr. Mitchell
She keeps this going on, so.
47:20 Selah
And we can take some pictures too.
47:22 Mrs. Sandra
I'll see you guys.
47:22 Selah
Thank you so much.
47:23 Mrs. Sandra
Take care, and I'll see you later. Okay, we'll go out here-
47:26 Selah
Yes
47:26 Mrs. Sandra
... go out the door here.
47:28 Selah
Yes.
47:28 Mrs. Mitchell
Okay. Thank you, Sandra.
47:29 Selah
Thank you.
47:30 Mrs. Sandra
Oh, let me leave this here.
47:32 Mr. Mitchell
We're still on?
47:33 Selah
Yes, we are.
47:34 Mr. Mitchell
Okay.
47:34 Selah
My camera really only has four minutes.
47:36 Mr. Mitchell
Okay. Okay. So I'm gonna kinda let her, I wanted to let her just speak a little bit and being the, the lady of the household.
47:43 Selah
S-
47:43 Mr. Mitchell
And her, how she's felt.
47:43 Selah
Yeah. Okay.
47:45 Mr. Mitchell
And what she's felt, you know, where she is in this home.
47:47 Mrs. Laverne
Um, hmm. I wasn't ...
47:54 Selah
She wasn't prepared for this.
47:55 Mrs. Laverne
Yeah, I was not prepared for this.
47:57 Mr. Mitchell
Just tell her how you enjoyed the home and, and where we are at the present.
48:02 Mrs. Laverne
Just being here twenty plus years and knowing the history of my husband, living here, growing up here, uh, the family love, the, um, just, you know, it's beautiful. It's beautiful. And I just wanna say that, um, even though my husband lived here, I it's, it's, it's more en- it's more than enough time for me to have and share my family, you know, g-give family memories-
48:38 Selah
Mm-hmm
48:38 Mrs. Mitchell
... of, of our own.
48:39 Selah
Mm-hmm.
48:40 Mrs. Sandra
So I'm just excited about it. I, I love this home. I love my husband, my family, and that's about it.
48:48 Selah
Well, I really appreciate this so much. Thank you.
48:54 Mr. Mitchell
And thank you so much, Julia.
48:56 Selah
Thank you. It's all-
48:57 Mr. Mitchell
Beautiful.
48:58 Selah
Mm-hmm.
48:58 Mr. Mitchell
That was nice.
48:59
All right.
48:59 Selah
It, that was really nice.
49:01 Mr. Mitchell
That was nice.
49:01 Selah
Yes.
49:01 Mr. Mitchell
Your que- your questions were very precise, and I like, I'm hoping I filled, uh, every value what it was. You know what I'm saying? You asked really easy questions, and it was not too far that I had to think.
49:12 Selah
Mm-hmm.
49:12 Mr. Mitchell
But that's why I wanted my cousin-
49:14 Selah
Mm-hmm
49:14 Mr. Mitchell
... because certain things she really... Y-y-you, you hear her. She can really kind of quantify on a lot of things that were-
49:21 Selah
Yes.
49:22 Mr. Mitchell
Yeah, yeah.
49:22 Mrs.Laverne
Oh, you want me to fix you a plate? A sandwich?
49:24 Selah
I will take a sandwich, yes ma'am.
49:26 Mrs. Laverne
So which bread do you like?
49:27 Selah
Mm.
49:27 Mrs. Laverne
This is a, uh-
49:28 Mr. Mitchell
We got tuna
49:29 Mrs. Mitchell
... tuna, Italian.
49:30 Selah
Italian.
49:30 Mrs. Laverne
Turkey.
49:31 Selah
Turkey. I'll probably take that one.
49:33 Mrs. Laverne
Yeah, you can have two.
49:34 Mr. Mitchell
I'll take a turkey.
49:34 Mrs. Laverne
Two. I mean, I'm, I'll fix a plate for you.
49:36 Mr. Mitchell
She gonna eat, she gonna eat one.
49:36 Mrs. Laverne
Oh, you wanna eat one there?
49:37 Selah
I'm gonna, Imma take it on the go.
49:38 Mrs. Laverne.
Okay.
49:38 Selah
'Cause I do have, uh-- Oh, this is pretty, this is great. I have class at like two o'clock-
49:Mrs. Laverne
Yes
49:42 Selah
... so I can eat this.
49:44 Mrs. Laverne
I have work. I have work.
49:44 Selah
Okay.
49:45 Mr. Mitchell
Beautiful.
49:46 Selah
Do you mind if we-
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